The Fall of Scientific American
Posted by littlexsparkee 2 days ago
Comments
Comment by kaonwarb 8 hours ago
> Inequity between male and female athletes is a result not of inherent biological differences between the sexes but of biases in how they are treated in sports.
(https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-theory-that-m... - and I am not quoting out of context)
Comment by bluealienpie 8 hours ago
“ Inequity between male and female athletes is a result not of inherent biological differences between the sexes but of biases in how they are treated in sports. As an example, some endurance-running events allow the use of professional runners called pacesetters to help competitors perform their best. Men are not permitted to act as pacesetters in many women's events because of the belief that they will make the women "artificially faster," as though women were not actually doing the running themselves.”
Comment by Gabriel54 7 hours ago
Comment by timr 8 hours ago
But that's obvious nonsense. It doesn't even pass a sniff test, if you know even the first thing about running. We're talking about many, many data points, all pointing in the same direction: in practice, men outperform women in distance sports [1].
To even begin to argue against this mountain of evidence, you have to resort to slippery rhetorical tactics, like this:
> As an example, some endurance-running events allow the use of professional runners called pacesetters to help competitors perform their best. Men are not permitted to act as pacesetters in many women's events because of the belief that they will make the women "artificially faster," as though women were not actually doing the running themselves.”
So, the argument being implied here (but not actually made!) is that the performance difference we see throughout the history of the marathon is due to...pace setters?
Y'all realize that the competitors can run faster than the pace setters, right?
This reminds me of the old expression: "Keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out."
[1] I'm talking about distributions here. Obviously, there are going to be many women who outperform many men on an individual basis.
Comment by onlypassingthru 7 hours ago
Boy, you sure picked the wrong category. It's women who are better at endurance events.† Men have an advantage in power events.
† Here's just 2 recent ones off the top of my head:
https://www.cnn.com/2026/07/05/us/american-solo-rowing-hawai...
https://www.womenshealthmag.com/fitness/a74192266/catherine-...
Comment by cutemonster 6 hours ago
> Pfendler ... after nearly a month and a half at sea ... appears to have broken both the previous women’s speed record as well as the men’s speed record
Would you say hunters keep running for 1 month to catch an antelope?
And:
> Catherine Breed, 33, didn’t look terribly exhausted ... swimming for more than 100 days ... the entire 900-mile length of the California coast
It makes sense if in ultra-ultra marathons, rowing, swimming, there's advantages to having more body fat and other female traits.
But hunting is shorter and quicker:
"Hunter-gatherers (such as the San people of the Kalahari Desert) typically pursue an antelope or kudu for 4 to 8 hours, covering a distance of roughly 10 to 30 kilometers (about 6 to 19 miles) before the animal collapses from heat exhaustion", an AI said.
(And, as the sibling comment about marathons says, then men are faster.)
Comment by timr 6 hours ago
https://runninglevel.com/running-times/marathon-times
https://swimswam.com/comparing-mens-womens-records-in-swimmi...
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1186/2052-1847-6-7
https://results.nyrr.org/event/M2025/overview (pick any year you like by changing the URL)
https://www.marathon.tokyo/en/about/past/2026/ (Same)
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-026-46032-9?fromPaywa...
The overall story is one where the difference in performance decreases with distance, but is very real.
Comment by Gabriel54 7 hours ago
Comment by adw 7 hours ago
Generally they can’t - the pace setters run at a pace above typical max for the distance (but within max for the shorter distance they are running), sheltering the people they’re pacemaking for.
You want to believe things are simple, but they’re not.
Comment by timr 7 hours ago
Come on. Think things through to the end. If it were actually true that the pace-setters could run faster than the competitors for the full marathon, then the pace-setters would win the event.
What you want to say is that the pace-setters are capable of running a faster pace than the competitors for a shorter distance. Maybe that's true (I doubt it), but it's not responsive. Pace setters are there to set a pace, like a metronome. If the competitors feel this pace is inadequate, there's absolutely nothing stopping them from running faster, or demanding a faster pace-setter.
Comment by adw 7 hours ago
Comment by timr 7 hours ago
You didn't, which is exactly the point. It's a critical piece of information for evaluating the truth and relevance of your argument.
Comment by adw 7 hours ago
Comment by jacquesm 6 hours ago
Comment by timr 6 hours ago
I was a distance runner.
Comment by antonvs 7 hours ago
Many of those data points are contaminated by a long tradition of sex- or gender-segregated races.
Here are a couple of interesting studies, which I assume are the ones the SciAm article is referring to, but I haven't checked.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38684111/ :
> "There is a prominent sex-based difference in athletic performance such that males outperform females by 7%-14% in races from 100 m to marathon. In ultramarathons, the difference is often much smaller, leading to speculation that females are "built" for the sport. However, data are confounded by the low number of female participants; just 10%-30% in any given race. This study compared data from two ultramarathons where males and females competed in comparable numbers. [...] In conclusion, the sex-based performance discrepancy shrinks to 1%-3% in ultramarathons when males and females compete in comparable numbers."
A key point in the above quote is "data are confounded by the low number of female participants; just 10%-30% in any given race." This calls the "many, many data points" that you mentioned into question.
Another study, https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12068597/, of 56 suitable races, found that "pacing was not consistently affected by sex or age."
Re keeping an open mind, the corollary is that if you're not willing to ever question your assumptions - a.k.a. biases - you're not going to be able to update your understanding based on the facts.
Comment by timr 6 hours ago
For ultramarathons, in particular, the performance difference is smaller, but it still exists. The most you can claim is that at ~200 miles there's a slight average performance advantage in pace for women in specific studies.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-026-46032-9?fromPaywa...
Comment by deng 8 hours ago
And yet, it seems you do not know that the gap between men and women shrinks the longer the distances get? Also, as you are saying yourself: this is about distributions, not necessarily about the top 0.1% of the world. The article makes the claim that on average, women would perform better in ultra-endurance events, supporting their thesis that women actually did the hunting back then. You might disagree with this, but the article is more nuanced, and reducing it to the rage-bait comment above does not do it justice at all.
Comment by timr 7 hours ago
So what? The gap exists. Saying that it diminishes with distance is interesting, certainly, but it's a far cry from evidence that the gender gap is due to something other than biology.
> The article makes the claim that on average, women would perform better in ultra-endurance events, supporting their thesis that women actually did the hunting back then.
This is sophistry. In reality, even on average, men are faster than women.
Comment by nfw2 8 hours ago
Title: The Theory That Men Evolved to Hunt and Women Evolved to Gather Is Wrong
Subtitle: The influential idea that in the past men were hunters and women were not isn’t supported by the available evidence
Saying there isn't enough evidence to prove a hypothesis is not the same as proving its negation. Failing to reject the null hypothesis is not the same as proving it.
Comment by missinglugnut 8 hours ago
Genuine or not they abandoned their readers who genuinely wanted to learn.
Comment by indy 8 hours ago
Comment by peter_retief 8 hours ago
Comment by jibalt 8 hours ago
Comment by lelanthran 7 hours ago
I feel that's an unwarranted assumption on your part: I read the article, even quoted from it in my comment, and my take agrees with your parent comments.
Your comment smells a lot like "They disagree with the article, so obviously they didn't read it, because anyone who read it would agree".
Comment by boxed 8 hours ago
Comment by jibalt 7 hours ago
I won't respond further.
Comment by boxed 3 hours ago
Comment by bluealienpie 8 hours ago
Comment by taneq 3 hours ago
Comment by synecdoche 8 hours ago
Comment by deng 8 hours ago
You totally are. This is about ultra-endurance events. You can downvote me all you want, but I have actually read the article.
Comment by nfw2 8 hours ago
Inequity between male and female athletes is a result not of inherent biological differences between the sexes but of biases in how they are treated in sports. As an example, some endurance-running events allow the use of professional runners called pacesetters to help competitors perform their best...
Comment by lelanthran 7 hours ago
> You totally are. This is about ultra-endurance events.
No, it isn't. It's about sports, using ultra-endurance as an example. This is one of the cases where the example is the exception.
IOW, the quote uses an outlier to make claims about the distribution. This is, of course, from the same institution that claims using the word "normal" to describe a distribution is some sort of "-ist" (racist, sexist, whatever).
Comment by skew-aberration 8 hours ago
Emphasis mine.
> Overall, females are metabolically better suited for endurance activities, whereas males excel at short, powerful burst-type activities. You can think of it as marathoners (females) versus powerlifters (males). Much of this difference seems to be driven by the powers of the hormone estrogen.
There are some pretty wild claims but overall, a fairly interesting article. I think they've just exaggerated an otherwise interesting point - that gender differences in hunting are not explained by differences in long-distance running aptitude (which are very small).
The examples of extant hunting techniques they themselves cited are not related to (ultra) long distance running anyway, so the connection between hunting and running is tenuous.
Comment by adw 7 hours ago
(Have a read about persistence hunting).
The article’s point is that the assumption that “men evolved to hunt” is unsupported by the evidence and therefore implicitly sexist. This is a defensible position.
Comment by skew-aberration 6 hours ago
Compare this to game drives/trapping which are both mentioned in this article and have significant archaeological and anthropological evidence.
Comment by ImaCake 8 hours ago
The full paragraph:
>Inequity between male and female athletes is a result not of inherent biological differences between the sexes but of biases in how they are treated in sports. As an example, some endurance-running events allow the use of professional runners called pacesetters to help competitors perform their best. Men are not permitted to act as pacesetters in many women's events because of the belief that they will make the women "artificially faster," as though women were not actually doing the running themselves.
To me both cultural and physiological differences are likely in play. I am not even sure how you could effectively seperate culture from physiology here (hard to do a randomised controlled trial on stride length - I guess Mendelian Randomisation regression might work?). Anyone confidently asserting only one or neither of these is at play is probably not stating that from a position of logic.
Comment by nfw2 7 hours ago
Comment by ImaCake 7 hours ago
Comment by skew-aberration 8 hours ago
Comment by jibalt 8 hours ago
And of course what they are talking about has nothing to do the criticism in TFA, which they also haven't read.
Comment by boxed 8 hours ago
Comment by pmontra 8 hours ago
It's easy to spot an increasing political stance in SciAm through those translated articles. That could please some readers and piss off others, it's understandable and of course it could be a risk for the sales maybe even for the Italian magazine.
However I also noticed another trend. The ratio of thearticles written by journalists vs the articles written by researchers increases from almost zero in the 80s to probably 1 nowadays. Unfortunately the articles from journalists are far more less detailed and interesting and place SciAm closer to the lower tiers of their competition.
Of course they have to compete with the whole of the scientific production on the internet now, but the answer of lowering quality seems wrong to me.
Comment by glimshe 9 hours ago
Comment by SanjayMehta 9 hours ago
The Atlantic went the same way, but as more mainstream magazine, that's kind of okay. Not acceptable for SciAm.
Comment by ternaryoperator 8 hours ago
Comment by timr 8 hours ago
For example, they publish this, now:
"The Revelatory Cringe of Anthony Fauci"
https://www.theatlantic.com/books/2026/07/anthony-faucis-emb...
Which, regardless of what you feel about Fauci, is at least against type for the Atlantic. But in 2020, they had no problem publishing garbage like this:
"Georgia's Experiment in Human Sacrifice"
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/04/why-georg...
Comment by youngprogrammer 8 hours ago
Comment by SanjayMehta 6 hours ago
Comment by timr 8 hours ago
Basically, formerly great media empires have declined to the point where only people willing to work for low wages in uncertain careers will accept positions writing for those institutions. So we mourn the loss of the brand, but if anyone actually cared about the brand in practice, it would not employ these people.
Comment by s1n_ 7 hours ago
Comment by SanjayMehta 5 hours ago
"Reporting" is replaced with "story," so journalists no longer journal - i.e. keep a record of what events took place, but turn it into a "story." A story has to have interesting elements, so now the creative writing has to be demonstrated, with a "hook" and a "narrative."
And instead of number of subscribers, they count "eyeballs" and "clicks" and "clickthroughs."
Comment by mitchbob 22 hours ago
Comment by pmontra 8 hours ago
Comment by marsten 8 hours ago
The magazine's low point was the infamous op-ed in 2021 about E.O. Wilson a few days after the biologist's death. It was basically a woke hit piece accusing him of scientific racism and white supremacy, with no evidence from his body of writing. It also criticized the genetics community at large for the term "normal distribution", which it took as offensive for implying that anyone outside the peak is "abnormal". (Never mind that "normal" has a technical definition in statistics.)
It's improved a lot over the last few years.
Still, I fear it may soon go the way of BYTE. Not because the need isn't there or because the market is gone, but because people get information in such different ways now.
Comment by froh 7 hours ago
people dynamics matter.
and we can and do _scientifically_ look at that part of "doing science".
for example in social sciences.
and their findings, and then attempts to remedy injustice uncovered in these findings are what drove and drives approaches for remedy, "policies".
these _of course_ are disputed by those benefitting from the status quo, like publishers as part of the top wealth percentile.
so far so obvious.
what baffles me is that some call injustice "issue du jour", when it is much older than Christianity.
even more so when as we found out taking care benefits business.
and I dare going one step further: if we don't discuss social implications of science and tech, the AI gives the wealthy cheap access to smarts, while it takes smarts the lever for a good life.
to me, the advent of AI puts the question of societal justice _in science_, in intelligence work, front and center.
Comment by bluealienpie 8 hours ago
Comment by lelanthran 9 hours ago
> Helmuth, who joined the magazine in 2020, had pushed it to cover more politics, arguing that science cannot be disentangled from its social context. Scientific American had issued presidential endorsements for the first time under her leadership. In 2024, after Helmuth called Trump supporters “bigots” and “fascists” on social media on election night, the magazine again became the target of right-wing backlash.
The magazine chose to go more political. When the political winds changed direction they found themselves on the wrong side of the new administration.
Remaining purely apolitical was an option for them.
Comment by ricksunny 8 hours ago
https://ksjhandbook.org/editing-controversial-science/about-...
“Trumped-up controversies about where the novel coronavirus originated have fueled racism and given cover to politicians who withdrew funding for international collaborations with China.”
That handbook was her leaving her indelible mark on all western scicomms editing.
Comment by ButlerianJihad 7 hours ago
My strongest memory is of the "Rubik's Cube" cover art, which depicted a quite impossible state of a Cube that was solved, except for one corner turned 1/3rd of the way. This was controversial, but certainly eye-catching, especially for a boy like me, striving to improve my solving record of 63 seconds.
Comment by peter_retief 8 hours ago
Why oh why destroy something so precious to so many people.
Spewing politcal hate is not the best way to win friends it seems.
Comment by nephihaha 8 hours ago
Unfortunately, when these pubs' readership started to decline, so did their revenue and they would have started taking money from "philanthropists" with an axe to grind. (Not always in the obvious areas. I used to read a local sports magazine which has ended up little more than a promotion for various private schools.)
There was always an element of soft power about Scientific American, and it was tailored partly to people without specialist expertise in whatever field, but it did not feel like political propaganda back in the nineties.
Comment by Grimeton 8 hours ago
The sheer idea that people from all political sides could be complaining because they don't want politics everywhere never comes to mind.
Also the fact that Helmuth fundamentally altered the magazine's course by pushing politics is completely ignored. Instead, when the owners have to forcefully correct the course it's being sold as threatening the magazine's independence.
Same old, same old...
Comment by MelonArmiger 1 hour ago
Comment by sparse-Matrix 4 hours ago
Comment by avalys 9 hours ago
So, an activist editor in chief focused on social justice nonsense and identity politics instead of on science, the resulting distraction ran it into the ground, and what used to be a respected institution is now struggling to recover from this disastrously poor leadership. A familiar story.
I used to enjoy SciAm. A few years ago I picked up an issue and was annoyed by several articles that used the mantle of “science” to push social, political and cultural issues. Articles about how mathematics is misogynistic and how some other field was racist or white supremacist, etc. The same bullshit as the rest of the media, frankly. So I put it down and haven’t read it again since. Too bad.
Comment by lynx97 8 hours ago
Comment by ternaryoperator 8 hours ago
Comment by wredcoll 9 hours ago
Comment by bigDinosaur 9 hours ago
Comment by bad_username 8 hours ago
Comment by wpm 8 hours ago
Somtimes it matters a great deal, yes. Sometimes. Not all the time. Not every time. Sometimes.
Comment by missinglugnut 8 hours ago
>Instead you doubled down on remaining ignorant. Not even that, but you think it's worth bragging about on the internet!
All that condescension to hide the fact that you haven't made a point. Stop insulting people and point to something in the magazine you think is worth reading. Or have you not read it either?
Comment by turbobutton 8 hours ago
Somehow, this ideology achieved this without any of the pressures of a totalitarian regime - just by being an intransigent minority.
Comment by turbobutton 7 hours ago
Comment by SanjayMehta 5 hours ago
Comment by SanjayMehta 5 hours ago
Manufactured outrage.